Would it be a good idea to remove any still present categories on retired pages? That way they won't divert attention from the game.

Aximillio (talk) 13:53, May 10, 2013 (UTC)

It's okay to leave them since the amount of retired content is minor. FL usually revises content rather than opting for complete removal.

Other reasons to use categories:
1) We'll need them for reference if we ever have to update category names or images.
2) If FL brings back retired pages, it'll be less work for us to resuscitate it: we simply remove the little "Retired" template and it's done, voilà!

ZDee (talk) 14:07, May 10, 2013 (UTC)

Kay, just wondering =P

Aximillio (talk) 14:09, May 10, 2013 (UTC)

And 3) it'll be easier for players to track down retired content to read or to help us verify if it's still there/not there. :)

ZDee (talk) 14:10, May 10, 2013 (UTC)

I added a sort key so all pages with this template go in the end in all their categories, hopefully that's a golden middleway. --DrinkKryptonitetalk 10:39, July 6, 2013 (UTC)

Oh, impressive. Thanks a lot, DK! :D
- ZDee (talk) 18:21, July 6, 2013 (UTC)

The "Help Mrs Gebrandt answer her correspondence" and its choices are out of retirement for the Feast of the Exceptional Rose. The Retired message said to dispute that here, so that's what I'm doin'.
Chipster (talk) 00:26, February 22, 2014 (UTC)

Suggestion that seasonal content should be treated as seasonal, and not retired. Edit

The SNOWBOUND! storylet is seasonal. It appears that its current content has not been changed since its initial release in 2012.

The wiki instructions on the 2012 pages say that the content is 'retired' and that we should create new pages for the same content for the current year. This seems inefficient and potentially confusing. Why not classify seasonal storylets as 'seasonal' rather than 'retired', and keep a history of the dates they've been available in the game, along with any edits?

Douglas Blacktyde (talk) 18:57, December 16, 2014 (UTC)

I agree that what we're doing now is wasteful and confusing.  We should consolidate the pages, mark them as seasonal _and_ when new differences are found from year to year either note it within the text or simply update the page and leave the page history for the history of the stories.

S'pht (talk) 17:08, December 30, 2014 (UTC)

I made some seasonal banners, which can be on the articles the entire year. We might need a letter to sort them on, perhaps? I'd also like feedback on the colours, because aestethics have never been my strong side.

Fangrosesmall This content is only available during the Feast of the Exceptional Rose!
Carcasssmall This content is only available during the Fruits of the Zee Festival!
Snowflakesmall This content is only available during the Christmas season!
Demetersmall This content is only available during Hallowmas!

—Preceding unsigned comment added by Aximillio (talkcontribs)

I think those are a good starting point and if people want to change 'em, it's a template anyhow :)  My big question is how do we want to deal with the content?  Are you OK with just combining and then leaving history to the history page?  My thinking is that since this is a living game the way the mechanics work now is the biggest use case and how things used to work is covered in history.  And to cover future changes, perhaps make the seasonal banners have a small text section saying something to the effect of 'details may have changed from last year if this recently went live' ?  Or maybe just a reminder from time to time on the front page?

S'pht (talk) 13:08, December 31, 2014 (UTC)

In recent years, quite a bit of the events have stayed the same. I think we should have one article for the current event, and adjust it if anything minor happens - such as one more CP in Connected the masters, a new option etc. People can check page history if they really badly want to read previous years, and I think current events are more important than history. If stories are retired or very different, I think we should retire them and make a new one.

I think we should have more opinions on this, though. — Aximillio (Message Wall) 16:46, December 31, 2014 (UTC)

I also agree that the wiki should reflect the most up to date content, for two reasons:

1. It's not as if a new player would first run into the 2011 Christmas content, then a year later the 2012 content, etc. New players will always see the latest content, the same as everyone else.

2. This is already the de facto way it's done for all other pages. When a page (nor necessarily seasonal) changes -- a new option, different rewards, etc. -- we update the page. We don't duplicate it to have an old version and a new verison. That's the whole point of a wiki.

Adnoam (talk) 22:22, December 31, 2014 (UTC)

Love the banners - agreed that it makes most sense to mark things as Seasonal rather than Retired. Also agree that we keep a 'current' article rather than duplicate content every year.

Perhaps if a new storylet/card/action is added to seasonal content we could make a note on it to that effect? i.e. First appeared 2014.

Jemann (talk) 00:20, January 1, 2015 (UTC)

Good idea. For keeping the historical info how about adding this to each template:

For historical notes click [[{{PAGENAME}}_(history)|here]].

That should autolink to a page with the same name but with "_(history)" at the end. This way any event page would have an accompanying history page. --Vae Victis (talk) 20:12, January 1, 2015 (UTC)

Thanks, everyone. I'm glad my suggestion seemed a good one. The banners are excellent. Douglas Blacktyde (talk) 08:56, January 2, 2015 (UTC)

Seasonal, Banners, and new Flags. Edit

I like the idea of the seasonal banners, and maintaining a single version of the content using most-recent versions.

As a newcomer to Christmas in FL, I've found it confusing, almost labyrinthine to browse through various iterations of the Sacks Days, some of which have (2013) or similar in their title, some of which don't, and being unsure if I'm reading truly retired content or just seasonally outdated stuff. The present is more important than history. But the most-recent season should probably be considered active-but-seasonal, and used as a guideline for what to expect in the next upcoming season. Looks like only a CP here or there changes, if at all, so a small disclaimer of this fact could help, at the top of seasonal content.

Sometimes a new option is added to a storylet. I would just integrate into last year's storylet and flag it as new seasonal content. Veteran players would probably appreciate that distinction, so they can see something different this time and flesh out their Journals. Perhaps a new Category: Seasonal Update, could be used for these rare examples of new changes to a festival. This category would be handy to browse the most recent changes to recurring festivals. Deciding when to un-flag it as an Update might be tricky. Probably when the season ends, or just before the next season begins again.

The seaonal banners look good and are a nice striking reminder of the temporary nature of the content. Visually speaking, I would say only the Fruits of the Zee banner needs work. The light blue clashes with the orange text, and it's hard to distinguish the URL text as clickable. The URL text on the Christmas banner is also hard to distinguish. It's about contrast, really. The banners are great.

If there are completionists out there, maybe they would want to create a historical record of each year's content so that it can be effectively played through using the wiki, but I think the current version takes precedence every time.

One other thing I would suggest is if we could have a way to flag connected seasonal content. Case in point: spending Fate to take a side on Day 4 of Mr Sacks. Depending who you side with, there seems to be two other connected actions on different Sacks Days. Knowing ahead of time what Day you're going to 'sacrifice' fulfilling the factions' plans is very helpful, and doesn't breach any Fate-locked rules. It just helps paying players organise their seasonal diary, espeically if they're new. =)

Jay Arafim (talk) 22:11, December 31, 2014 (UTC)

Carcasssmall This content is only available during the Fruits of the Zee Festival!

This one, perhaps?

Marking new options with (NEW) on the storylet/card pages, as well as mentioning when an option was introduced on the action pages themselves? Also mentioning it when there's connected storylets in cases like the sackmas options. Got it.

Aximillio (Message Wall) 03:11, January 1, 2015 (UTC)

Much easier on the eyes =).

Seen some of the seasonal changes being implemented already. Hooray! My thanks to all involved.

For the NEW content marker, if we could make a Category called NEW for more than just seasonal stuff [Ambitions, Conversations, Fate stories like The Gift], then people who have reached content boundaries in general can check the wiki's New category. They can see, at a glance, what's new in FL - to encourage boundary players to return to FL and enjoy it more. =)

Jay Arafim (talk) 06:38, January 1, 2015 (UTC)

Not sure about a NEW marker or category, unless we want the additional work of removing it after sufficient time. Using the year instead would be less trouble.

Jemann (talk) 08:34, January 1, 2015 (UTC)

"Good idea. For keeping the historical info how about adding this to each template:
For historical notes click [[{{PAGENAME}}_(history)|here]]. […]"

Would it suffice to link to Christmas (historical) or so? Otherwise we'll need a lot of pages!

That would look like this:

This content is only available during the Christmas season!
For Christmas history, see Christmas (historical)

Alternatively, adding

Snowflakesmall For Christmas history, see Christmas (historical)

to the Christmas page? — Aximillio (Message Wall) 20:54, January 1, 2015 (UTC)

That works, too. I like the first banner - seems more complete. Vae Victis (talk) 21:19, January 1, 2015 (UTC) Added it. Looks good. --Vae Victis (talk) 21:36, January 1, 2015 (UTC)

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